Jun
16
You’d think I’d have learned my lesson. Certain blog topics have not been kind to me–panties, politics, pygmy goats. Okay, so I’ve never had any negative feedback about pygmy goats. I have been attacked by them though.
I’ve sworn off talking about undergarments for the next five years (at least!), and I’ve shied away from talking politics ever since the election. If you were reading back then, you might remember a post or three where I spoke my mind about the candidates and what they stood for. Then I stepped over the edge of propriety and suggested that if the Republicans would have won, Election Day and Inauguration Day might not have been quite so peaceful.
And then I stopped talking about politics in the interest of getting along with everyone.
But I’m feeling a tug. A little nudge in my side, a little whisper in my ear that’s saying, “Are you afraid of losing friends? The gospel offends, you know.”
Here’s what I don’t ever want to be: a person who is such a people-pleaser that she’ll compromise her beliefs in order to gain/maintain popularity. Because you know what? That’s the very thing that’s bothering me about our President at the moment.
You’ve got to stand for something or you’ll fall for anything (and for some reason, I’m hearing a twangy country tune in my ear as I type that).
And sorry about all the bunny-trailing, but I just realized that I have a “politics” category on my sidebar. Apparently, I’ve blogged about politics 14 times in the past 3+ years. And yes, my last post was January 21. Feel free to browse the archives for more background on my political leanings.
I meant to get my thoughts all in a row like little duckies before I opened Pandora’s box of Politics, but that’s not going to happen. Too much going on in my head, at my desk, in my life. So, I’m just going to take the plunge, throw a few things out there, and pray that my words will be more Spirit-inspired than flesh-incited.
I saw President Obama and his family on the lawn of the White House Saturday. We were pretty far away, but Gabe’s big camera lens + photoshop magnification confirmed that it was the First Family (and their dog). We took a walking tour of DC after the National Zoo and just happened to be at the White House when they came outside.
I felt warm and fuzzy and wanted to be their best friends.
At first glance–and even second and third glances–our President seems to embody many of the values I hold dear. Stomping out prejudice, loving the orphaned and oppressed, embracing people of every tribe and tongue, learning to get along peacefully with our neighbors, loving our enemies.
But something keeps nagging me.
See, I believe the whole Bible to be true. And not only true but the inspired Word of the one true God. A God who is the same yesterday, today, and forever. A God who does not lower His eternally holy standards no matter how much we, His creation, “progress.”
Things that weren’t okay back then aren’t okay now. (And I’m not talking about Leviticus and the like–once Jesus died, we were under the new covenant.)
I’m talking about things like–it’s not okay to murder, even if you do while the person is still inside his mother’s body. And that sex outside of marriage is not okay–and that marriage is for one man and one woman, not 2 men or 2 women. And that when the God of the Bible says He created the world, that’s what He meant.
I’m talking about Jesus saying that He is the way, the truth and the life. And that no one can get to God–or heaven–except through Him. All other roads, no matter how sweet-sounding or sensible, lead to hell.
I know a lot of you cringe when you hear the word “prophecy.” Another P word! It conjures up images of hairspray-plastered weirdos declaring that the end of the world is upon us, that Obama is the anti-Christ, that Jesus is coming back on March 2, 2010.
But there sure are a lot of things happening in the world today that match right up with what Bible prophets of old said would happen when the end draws near. And we’ve been warned that peace will be a buzzword that’s actually a pre-cursor to much bloodshed and violence (But that’s a post or two in and of itself, and honestly, I don’t even know if that last sentence made sense.).
This post is already longer than licorice, and what have I even said? Maybe this first post will just ease us into a healthy, God-honoring discussion. Apparently, I do better when I enter the proverbial political pool one toe at a time, rather than cannon-balling right in.
I don’t know much, but I do know that I want to follow hard after Christ. And that a time is coming (or has already come) when we’re going to have to take a real stand. When choosing to follow Christ (and Him alone) isn’t going to be popular.
And while I’m tempted to walk around with my head in the clouds, feeding giraffes and leaving the poli-talk to the zealots, I feel a sense of responsibility.
To stand up for my God who laid down His life for me.
If you have (respectfully-phrased) questions or comments, I’d love to try to respond to some of them. I can’t abandon the Zoo Track obviously, and I did mention that this would be Dad Month (where has the month gone??), but I can intersperse political convo here and there.
Thanks for reading. Blessings on your Tuesday!
Marla, I love the stuffings out of you!!! You have NO idea how much you have blessed me over the past year or so. Praise God for anointed women like yourself. I feel like the popular girl on the block because you stopped by to visit me today. I know you don’t ever want to be put on a pedestal, but you are one dedicated servant, sister. And I love you, admire you, and honor you so, so much! Thank you for giving us a forum here today to respectfully share our views.
Lisa, you have blessed me MUCH today. (so many of you have!) Thank you.
Andrea, I do not discriminate against gays. I do not judge. God forbid it. If I were perfect, I could judge. I’m far from it. Not once did I say I take issue with the way anyone lives their lives. I choose to live my life a certain way because I have found freedom in that way.
If I met you on the street, I would not lay hands on you and say, “Repent!” I would not tell you that I would only be your friend if you were a Christian. But what I would do is try to live my life through Christ so that His light shines through me and others can see and are drawn to it, drawn to Him. Am I perfect at it? Absolutely not.
My mission in life is not to convert as many as possible to Christianity. It just isn’t. Because it’s not my job — Christ does it all on His own, in His time, and in His way. And if He chooses to use me to bring another to Him, then I am a willing vessel. I know my words here aren’t going to make one bit of difference to you. But His love of you, I pray, will in His time, and in His way.
The proof that Christians will be persecuted is explicitly stated in the Bible. 2 Timothy 3:12 – “In fact, everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted…”
The Bible is from God Himself. 2 Timothy 3:16 – “All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness…” He used fallible humans to write the words, but the words are from God Himself.
There is a price for aborting a child. The mental anguish the abortive mother feels is often lifelong and brutal. Talk to a handful and see how many agree. Not to mention the plans God had for that child’s life, as He does for all of us. This is what I meant. And the ramifications of same sex marriage… the inability to have a natural sexual relationship that culminates in the production of a child, among other things, diminishes the beauty of a union that is meant to emulate God’s love for His church. I do not hate gays by any means, nor will I stand in judgment of them if they decide to marry. I am simply speaking from a humanistic and biological perspective. I know many gay couples, love them, are friends and family with them, and know them to be wonderful, warm people (some of the warmest, most accepting people on the planet) but simply put, marriage is an earthly model of a heavenly relationship, and as much as two people of the same sex may love each other, their union does not follow this model. And I don’t say that in judgment. Once again, God forbid.
I respectfully submit these answers to the areas you highlighted. Once again, I know my words won’t “convert” you to my way of thinking. But I offer them freely and appreciate the time you took to read my responses.
Andrea, dude, you’re giving me a headache.
I can only read so much fine print in one day!
@Marla: James 1:26
If anyone considers himself religious and yet does not keep a tight rein on his tongue, he deceives himself and his religion is worthless.
“Religion” is used in the bible, why you refuse it?
@Lisa: yes you can (very Obam-ish
)
And this is my uneducated response:
The Bible is God’s word [false. It has been written by humans]. God breathed and God inspired [maybe God inspired but people wrote it. Your Christian belief is that man=phallacy. How comes the bible not be erroneous?]. It reveals Him to us, and the more we want to find out about Him through His word, the more we will discover. The Bible is not meant to be a condemnation of opposing views (there is no condemnation in Christ (Romans 8:1) [that says that there is no condemnation in Christ. Does not say that it does not exist in other religions. Since you are in a mission to convert people to Christianity and bible says clearly that there is just one God...that logically gives that all the non-christian are condemned] but God is explicit in telling us what actions, words, beliefs, and behaviors, will bring us the most freedom, joy, and peace in this life [Yes. The rule's book, the bible]. There is a price for aborting a child that goes far beyond the cost of the physical life lost [absolutely with you on this, but you're not the one paying it]. There is a price for marrying someone of the same sex that goes far beyond the cost of how others might perceive us should we choose to do so [you're not paying the price of marrying the same sex. In Christian words, let God save them and you not discriminate them because they're not enlightened]. We might not know the full cost until we reach the other side of heaven, but it is grave and it is unfathomable [true, but you can't be God and judge that person for Him. Forgive him and not discriminate him]. Is there any such thing as an unforgivable sin? I don’t believe so. We all fall short and all must stand in judgment when we reach our eternal home.
I think too often we humans view the Bible as a rule book rather than God’s passionate pursuit of a relationship with us [...you just said that he gave us the rules...]. He desires our worship, not because He’s on a God-sized ego trip, but because He knows it’s our only chance of saving ourselves FROM ourselves [now...this is hard to understand. I challenge you to put this sentence into a muslim's mouth (or a taoist, or an hinduist...) and guess your reaction. "We must worship him because he knows that it's our way to save from ourselves". Double-sommersault logic trip
]. The more we focus on Him, the more He keeps us from our self-destructive ways. God loves us regardless of who we are or what path we choose in life [...so he should love also gays]. He loves us whether we love Him back or not [...so if he loves gays, why you don't love them?].
Christians WILL be persecuted. It’s just the plain fact [any proof of this?] Christianity is such a radical departure from any other world religion (what other deity humbles itself to its creation [unfortunately my English is not perfect...I'm not sure to have understood this sentence], doesn’t force itself on any human being [What? Ever studied other religions? Buddhism, taoism, Hinduism, just to name some], and lays down its life to free its creation from the bondage of sin [the fact is that other religions does not start with a sin! You start with a sin and then you praise God because it lets you free from this sin. Starting without a sin would be much better...like Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism...probably all of them starts without any faultyness by design]?) that it’s no wonder Christians are often viewed as radical themselves. If following Christ makes me radical in another’s eyes, that’s the chance I’m willing to take [In fact you SHOULD and HAVE To stand for your ideas. ]. When someone tells me to stop the “God talk” so they can get on with their everyday life without thoughts of eternity, I remind myself that it’s not up to me to change their mind — it’s up to God. I’m just the willing vessel [true. Then why "you" discriminate gays?].
————
Thanks for your thoughts, Lisa. I highlighted what can be seen, from a non – christian, some logical errors. I’d like you, if you want, to elaborate on those.
Oops, I forgot to add that, like you, Marla, I believe Christianity is a relationship vs. a religion. It is God’s pursuit of each one of us individually, not His tyrannical attempt to get us all to follow Him like lemmings in mindless obedience. If only everyone knew how intimately they are loved, and how incomprehensibly much they are valued. It would make ALL the difference. But God will never force Himself on anyone. But oh, when we ask Him in, He will reveal Himself in the most unmistakable ways. I get goosebumps thinking about all the times He has made known to me just how much He loves me, but I’m always left with the impression also that He loves ALL His creation equally, and that is what makes me KNOW He is real. How could I have a thought like that on my own, imperfect and flawed as I am???
I’ve already started praying, Andrea.
And the fact that Gabe has already explained the “personal relationship” aspect of Christianity warms my heart.
I married a good man. Correction: a sinner made good by Christ.
Have a good night!
May I offer my very uneducated perspective?
The Bible is God’s word. God breathed and God inspired. It reveals Him to us, and the more we want to find out about Him through His word, the more we will discover. The Bible is not meant to be a condemnation of opposing views (there is no condemnation in Christ (Romans 8:1) but God is explicit in telling us what actions, words, beliefs, and behaviors, will bring us the most freedom, joy, and peace in this life. There is a price for aborting a child that goes far beyond the cost of the physical life lost. There is a price for marrying someone of the same sex that goes far beyond the cost of how others might perceive us should we choose to do so. We might not know the full cost until we reach the other side of heaven, but it is grave and it is unfathomable. Is there any such thing as an unforgivable sin? I don’t believe so. We all fall short and all must stand in judgment when we reach our eternal home.
I think too often we humans view the Bible as a rule book rather than God’s passionate pursuit of a relationship with us. He desires our worship, not because He’s on a God-sized ego trip, but because He knows it’s our only chance of saving ourselves FROM ourselves. The more we focus on Him, the more He keeps us from our self-destructive ways. God loves us regardless of who we are or what path we choose in life. He loves us whether we love Him back or not.
Christians WILL be persecuted. It’s just the plain fact. Christianity is such a radical departure from any other world religion (what other deity humbles itself to its creation, doesn’t force itself on any human being, and lays down its life to free its creation from the bondage of sin?) that it’s no wonder Christians are often viewed as radical themselves. If following Christ makes me radical in another’s eyes, that’s the chance I’m willing to take. When someone tells me to stop the “God talk” so they can get on with their everyday life without thoughts of eternity, I remind myself that it’s not up to me to change their mind — it’s up to God. I’m just the willing vessel.
Don’t know if this made any sense but it’s what’s been rattling around in my brain. It’s such a dangerous position to take to say that the imprint of Christianity on the soil of history is just the same as all the others. If we look closely, we’ll see that it’s off on a path all its own, and to travel it is far from the safest route. But oh, is it worth it, if we can only stick to it!
@Marla: you and Gabe will have a lot to pray, tonight, for the Holy Spirit to enlight me
I’m kidding, of course.
I never said that your ideas are foolish: they’re not mine, and I personally consider them very distant. But saying that they’re foolish will make an assumption to your intelligence (you would be a fool), which I never done and never will.
Gabe already told me about this “personal relationship” thing, that you’re is not a “religion” and all this stuff.
You don’t have to convince me, because there is nothing to explain.
To me, again respectfully, it’s just a game of wording.
A religion is a set of beliefs (your beliefs) and a set of formal rules (a.k.a. The Bible). And that’s all. All this “personal relationship” thing is just your “relationship with God” or, better, “your relationship with these beliefs”, or, again, “your way to follow these beliefs”.
But all within this religion.
What I can’t understand is not the “personal relationship” but the fact that you kinda refuse this “religion” word. Why it is “not a religion”? Don’t you follow Bible rules? Don’t you follow Christian beliefs? Don’t you try your best to evangelize people and “pray for people to recognize God”?
Then you’re in a religion: a set of beliefs that you follow. All of the joking with words and definitions are IMHO just circling around. I just found this
http://www.knightforchrist.com/Articles-S/christianity-not-a-religion.htm
Too long to read…seems that it says “since a lot of religions are man-made, and man-made things are not perfect as god, we are not a religion. Religion is connected to sinful things – ??? – and Christianity no.”
It’s like saying “i built something that has an engine, a gearing and goes on tires. Looks like a car, but is much more perfect than a car. So let’s call it…uhm…a Strumble!”.
Strumble is a car, whatever wording you choose.
I really don’t understand why you’re so scared about this simple definition. Popes (remember: God’s representation on Earth) calls it Religion and it’s not at all a discrimination or a bad word.
Oh and by the way: we “non christian” believes that you’re not a sinner. That you are a wonderful person, not a sinner. That you’re not punished for being here.
) life would be much more heavy. 
Once you realize that (but as you said, I will never be able to convince you- never in a million years
@Kimberly. Can I, very respecfully, show you some VERY DISTANT different point of views?
“When he imposes a national health care plan that requires doctors to perform abortions against their beliefs”
…let’s rephrase…
“When he imposes a national health care plan that requires doctors to respect the patient will, without imposing THEIR beliefs to the patient’s one”.
Now it looks much better.
In Italy abortion is legal. Private doctors can still refuse, public doctor cannot (even if some of them does). Because their are serving the country, _not themselves_, and they have a patient, they’re not in a mission. The country is not a religion. They’re paid to make their DUTY, to serve the patient.
I know it looks this way to you “I am a doctor and I want to save lifes, not kill them”. Fair point, totally respected. A solution: in each hospital there MUST be AT LEAST always ONE doctor that performs abortions. All the others can refuse.
“When he requires that an owner of a house rent to anyone, regardless of their sexual status, or be accused of illegally discriminating”
…again rephrase…
“when he requires that an owner of a house rent to anyone, regardless OF BEING SO CURIOUS ABOUT THE PRIVATE LIFE of the buyer”
You have an house. You rent. End of the game. What the person does in his PRIVATE and STRICTLY private life, is NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS.
To put in another view: do you think you will “solve” the “gay problem” by not having them an house? Do you think that they will be “back to normal” if they can’t rent your house?
What if you rent an house to a “perfect family” and then you discover, after, that they don’t go to church or they swear god or they have promiscous sex? Does the “appearance” of a perfect family saves you?
Who is saved? You? The perfect family? The religion? Or just the appearance?
See? Just these two ideas, in Europe, are seen as extremist (or more technically highly conservative)
Andrea, if only I could convey to you what my “Christianity” really entails.
As hard as this may be for you to understand, it’s not a religion. My faith is a personal relationship with a God who is living and active. A God who sent his own Son, Jesus Christ, to pay the penalty for my sin. A God whose very own Spirit lives inside my heart.
I’m no better than anyone else. I’m a miserable sinner. But Jesus has taken away my sin.
I would never be able to convince you of this–not in a million years. Only the Holy Spirit can stir inside of you and change your mind and heart.
I’ll pray for that very thing.
Until then, I appreciate your willingness to dialogue and your attempts to understand our “foolish thoughts.”
Thank you.
@Gabe: I think that the people that “hates” the God you follow are very very very very very very very very very very very (ok it’s enough) FEW.
Those are extremist. Like in medieval times Christianity went after Muslims with the Crusades, now there is a bunch of stupid people trying to do the same.
What I think is that the highly conformist areas of Christianity are seen too rigid and too extreme to be valid in 21st century. That’s a point of view, of course.
After all….you “strong” Christians sees satan everywhere
@Tim/Marla: as you may have noticied
I live in Italy. And in Italy there’s Rome, and in Rome there’s the Vatican. Even if it’s a “different country”, it does not have actual borders: none phisical and even less moral/spiritual/cultural. Italy is a country with an history which is far far far longer than USA, and that history is Roman and Christian/Catholic. USA got their influence from Britain, which is Christian but Protestant/Anglican.
We have ten times (probably much more) churches than are present in USA, we have mostly mandatory religious teaching at school (not sure about USA…) and priests and vatican that is highly influential into the government and cultural life. The pope trasmit his Angelus every Sunday and it’s aired on the main public TV all the times.
Muslim, also, here does not have freedom of speech. They’re mostly excluded from society. We have a party, which now has an important role in government (Italy parliament is fractured in about 6/8 major parties, there isn’t actual Dem/Rep division, and to govern, they make coalitions), which would like to expel all non-italians from Italy and our prime minister (the most important function) said that “we are not for the multiethnic Italy”. This should clarify how much “local” we are.
Christian accounts for 91% of Italian population, with 87% being Catholic.
So, we have quite an experience in Catholicism and Christianity
Still, if you ask here in Italy and also in Europe, very few (if actually none) believes, for example, to Creationism, something very “into” the American Christian community (wiki says 45% of Americans). For us, and for all Europe, it is seen VERY “extreme”, even among Christian and even among priests. If you ask a priest here, he will say that the Bible is “true” but it’s allegorical, it should not be taken literally. You will have an hard time finding some Christian that believes in creationism (I challenge you to try). Also because various popes are FOR evolutionism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_and_the_Roman_Catholic_Church#Pope_Pius_XII)
In Italy and in Europe you won’t find “signs” in front of the Churches, trying to “buy” religion. Here we use a lot less the God words (“if God wants”, “for God’s will” and we don’t have God written on money
)
Are we more “sinful” because of this?
So as you can see you have a continent which has long roots into Christianity and a more “moderate” approach. Do you think, then, that the moorings have been damaged, due to this? Not at all: churches are still there, religion is still there. Lived in a less “formal” (if you ask me, I would say “healthier”) way but still there. Since A LOT LONGER TIME than USA!
How can you then think that an highly Christianized America (45% of Creationists in America makes it, for us, VERY into religion – almost fanatically) can loose his Christianity?
Of course in your point of view ANYTHING LESS than what is now is a “sin” or a “sign of satan”. What I think is exactly this: the American Christian is not into “change”, modernization of religion, because it’s a sign of Satan. It’s strictly “how it was now it has to be”. And this is, IMHO, a big threat to Christianity.
In other words: if you want to make Christianity live, if you want to go through these “difficult times” you should reconsider your monolithic opinion. Some rules and beliefs were valid when people had no studies, during medieval times. Now Christianity is paying this rigidity and this…uhm…let’s say…”considering people guilty by design” (an all-loving, all-caring God that makes you faulty and you have all your life to pay this? This sounds illogical, irrational an unjust to non-christian people) is making people “reconsider”. They simply dont’ feel themselves guilty for something they haven’t done.
To close this long msg: I don’t think you know what is “persecution”. Visit Auschwitz, visit the Italian jews museums, visit the indian “dalit” community, or visit Tibet, try to be a catholic in Iran or try to be a liberal in China. THAT is persecution. Being forced to “redefine” your view of God, to be a little elastic is definitely not persecution. If bet that you’re (you=”strong” Christians) not “persecuted” in America, but more “socially excluded”, looked like an alien, maybe. This IMHO…no, sorry in my VERY VERY VERY humble opinion…is because people is seeing that…well…God is a little less “formal” and a little more loving
Well, weren’t we talking about Obama?
@Lindsay: thank you. I live in Italy but I’ve been in America more than one time, I worked for an American company and now I work with an Swedish one, all around Europe (btw: to your americans, probably the really lovable Sweds are all sinners
). here comes my multi national culture. Also is it is much easier to being influenced by American culture, beucase you export so much (technology, lifestyle, trends…)
Standing in the gap with you sista
@Rachelle Great point. Almost creates an image in my mind of America in the middle of a great battle, playing innocent to both sides who have different views. A battle with extremists who hate the Christ we follow, pro-choice advocates who murder the children our God created, and so on.
The battle is starting intensify all around us, and the more we drift towards the middle the less intelligent we’ll actually start looking. It might seem like Obama has it all figured out now, but we can only play dead for so long. It’s a bit obvious when our country doesn’t stand for anything.
@Andrea: I really do agree, that Europe is at such a great advantage for travel. I really do believe that makes it so much more easy to be exposed to different cultures, beliefs, lifestyles.
I just absolutely love hearing the opinion who is not from America. I have heard so much back and forth, hearsay, etc about how people in other countries view us, but to hear from you, first hand, makes it much more powerful. I really do appreciate you expressing your opinions – I think that is great! Knowing what one believes in makes that person so much stronger – in my opinion.
or to bring it home: when we ‘Christians’ avoid confrontation (in an attempt to preserve peace) we are setting ourselves up for war with the world. If we actually believe that there is not going to come a time when we’ll have to ‘step up to the plate’, then we are greviously mistaken.
Good post and discussion. It reminded me of something I just read from a book by Dave Harvey, “When Sinners say I Do” (which I know seems off topic), but the quote bears a strong truth that is the epitome of what is happening in this administration and in the world:
“In an attempt to preserve peace, we sow war.”
Harvey is referring to avoiding healthy confrontation in marriage to address sin. So to tie this all together: President Obama, in an attempt to preserve peace, is in reality avoiding confrontation, sadly this is likely to lead our nation into more confrontation (not of our choosing).
Well said Kimberly!
Bless you, Tim Alley. You just saved me 20 minutes of writing. I was about ready to respond to Andrea, and that is EXACTLY what I was going to say.
Christians ARE being persecuted in America, Andrea, and it WILL only get worse. And I’m not talking about the wackos. I’m talking about regular ol’ church-going, law-abiding citizens.